Zenith Aircraft Builders and Flyers
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Aux.or Boost fuel pumps
I was asked to tear down a plane that had crashed, and find the problem , the FAA and Rotax had inspected the plane and decided it was a pilot problem, the fuel bowls were empty and they were able to bypass all systems and start the motor , I found the FACET fuel pump that was inline to have failed and totally shut off the fuel, one person died because of the crash, DO NOT PUT A PUMP INLINE < PUT IT IN A BYPASS LOOP or leave it out you do not need a boost pump on most aircraft engines , also fly the plane no matter what happens ...BOB
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Gil DeVault on
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Is there a diagram/drawing for a by pass loop for the 601/650
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Permalink Reply by Joe Spencer on
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>>>GIL, first of all dont put ethanol in a 912 uls motor and thankfully they dont sell the crap in alaska ..BOB
Yeh I would rather not put ethanol in my 912 either but in some places that's all we can get unless it's avgas which isn't good either. The disadvantages to both can be minimized with proper handling...Blue Stabil in ethanol and don't let it sit very long or it'll probably go bad even with the stabil in it. And TCP(Decalin Runup) in avgas. Bout best some of us can do and it's being done every day. And after all even the 912 ULS is approved for ethanol.
Pick your poison.
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Permalink Reply by Bob Jones on
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Joe, I didnt realize that ROTAX approves ethanol, I thought it was only in rare cases when good gas was not available , what state are you in ? all that we have visited had RV gas PREMIUM unleaded, available , the biggest reason not to use it is because we have vented gas tanks and the alcohol grabs water from air and forms jello , BUYER BE AWARE!!!BOB
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Hi Bob
Yeah, Rotax SI 912-016 authorizes 10% E fuels
5.1)Automotive fuelsIn addition to AVGAS various automotive fuel types with different quality are available. Due to variousenvironmental, economic and political reasons a number of fuel types with different amount of ethanol blend isavailable. Therefore the maximum amount of ethanol blend is defined as follows:5.1.1)E10 (Unleaded gasoline blended with 10 % ethanol)In addition to AVGAS and unleaded automotive fuel (Mogas) the ROTAX®912/914 Series of engines arenow approved for use with E10.I've heard all the supposed problems associated with ethanol use. I don't like the stuff but after many years of use I haven't had any problems other than it goes bad pretty soon. I've always been skeptical of the stated problem of attracting moisture. That can be an advantage...the E absorbs the water in solution with the gas/E and it passes harmlessly thru the motor. When we get water in our car tank we pour in a bottle of heat right? Alcohol if I'm not mistaken. I understand if there's too much water the E can separate out with the water and now we got straight gas with unknown AKI. I've never heard of that actually happening; I suppose that scientifically maybe so but in my experience a non factor.The hoses and stuff we got nowadays are usually OK with E so with reasonable care that shouldn't be much of a problem. I did careful takeoff distance on my 701 with avgas and 93 E cargas and there was no measurable difference. I just run the stuff, like it or not.
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Permalink Reply by christopher fryatt on
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Inquiring minds still want to know exactly what model facet pump failed, So far seems most of us are damned with the curse!
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Chris, I believe the pump model #is 40105N, there is no Model #'s on the pumps, this # came off of the Pump Box. ...Bob
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Permalink Reply by Don Morrisey on
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On Facet pumps the model number is typically on the bolt flange with two numbers to the left of the hole and 3 to the right
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Permalink Reply by Shawn Magin on
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There is an app called PURE GAS which shows all ethanol free gas stations in the entire U.S. on a map.very useful.
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Great App...just downloaded it and found ethanol free 14 miles away. THANKS SHAWN!!
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Permalink Reply by Jim and Amelia Isaacs on
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As I pause and ponder if I will continue at all with my original plan to install the $42 facet pump I bought for my Rotax 912 equipped 701 I’m building, I’m contemplating installing it in a bypass loop, using it only to start the engine, switching it off for flight operations, and replacing it at each annual.
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Permalink Reply by Carl Orton on
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Just revisiting this issue as it really bothers me. Risk is based on probability and consequence of a failure. As an example, "engine explosion" would have very high consequences, but the probability is low enough that we still fly single engine planes.
In another forum, I asked an acquaintance, who's VERY knowledgeable about NTSB reports and investigations, if I could search for a given component manufacturer by name to see occurrences of FACET pump failures, in this specific case.
The report which resulted had only one Facet fuel pump related failure, in 2005 on an RV-6A. Other incidents that were thought to be fuel related, with Facet pumps, resulted in the pumps working normally on post-crash examination.
For the case in which you were assisting in the investigation, perhaps it was recent-enough that the report hadn't been finalized? Or, if the word "facet" was not used, that would have resulted in a false report as well.
Not doubting your work; I'm just trying to gain as much insight as possible. I don't want to slough it off, but don't want to over-design just the same. Thank You for any additional information you might be able to share....
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