Comment

Comment by Chris Aysen on June 14, 2011 at 8:15am

Peter - Your page says you are a CFI. So you realize that most us private pilots are "Single Engine Land" rated. As you know thats not a particular make/model aircraft "type" rating. Therefore my doing a full flap power off landing can be done in the aircraft of "my" (pilot's) choice. So from a practical standpoint I choose Cessnas for my BFRs. I completed mine yesterday in a 172..... Andre - I never use flaps on my 701; they're just not needed. So when we look at the drag this aircraft produces and its subsequent sink rate I don't think it is wise to perform that maneuver. It would be a kin to making a decision to land on a soft/short field with a Cessna (not recommended by most CFIs). The CFI may require a power off landing in your STOL but flap usage is your choice. I personally don't recommend it. My two cents.

Chris

Comment by Peter Bennett on June 13, 2011 at 9:53pm

EXCELLENT QUESTION, ANDRE. No, I don't believe you picked the wrong plane.  The CH-750 does the STOL thing even without flaps.  It does even better using them, but it isn't a free lunch. You have to practice, practice, practice. And keep in mind my interest focused on getting advice about dead-stick full-flap landings. Using partial power is another matter. 

Comment by Andre Levesque on June 13, 2011 at 8:01pm

So what's the use of a STOL plane like the "Z" if we cannot use full flap landings?  with or without engine?

Did we pick the wrong aircraft?  -:)

Comment by Peter Bennett on June 13, 2011 at 3:54pm

Chris, notwithstanding the demands of my CFI, I must agree with Doug Dougger and others, including you. 

Comment by Chris Aysen on June 13, 2011 at 11:16am

Peter - I would not do that type landing in that type aircraft. My two cents.

Safe Flying!

Chris

Comment by Peter Bennett on June 7, 2011 at 10:30am

More full-flap practice this morning. I definitely used power and attitude for control.  My main impressions were (1) sluggish control on final with full flaps, and (2) tendancy to skid with any braking initially after touchdown.  I must say that, so far, a full-flap landing would be my last choice in a dead-stick situation. 

Comment by Doug Dugger on June 7, 2011 at 10:12am

It is my experiance in the CH750 that a full flap landing no power is a good way to damage your craft, yes it can be done but is not nessassary at all. How much time in type did your instructer have. I have about 300 hrs in our 750 demo and do not use full flap no power landings. Engine out really out will give you hardly any flare at landing unless you keep your speed up higher than  nessessary. It lands much better with a touch of flaps and about 50 of so when you actually flare the aircraft. Your speed transfers into the flare and slows you down very fast. Keep practicing and y;ou will find it a great back country plane.

Comment by Peter Bennett on June 6, 2011 at 6:26pm

Good question, Conrad. All I have to offer is my personal point of view.  The way I see it, I have an obligation to maximize the potential performance of the plane by maximizing my ability to pilot it because (1) it's fun to do, a (2) I look forward to landing on beaches and ranches, and (3) it might one day save my ass. As far as risk goes, ALL manuvers are risky if I can't do them well, and that includes normal, no-flap landings. I have signed so many documents and forms absolving anyone, anything, and everyone from ANY responsibility for ANYTHING that goes wrong, mostly because I'm dealing with a home-built. It's a good idea to be ready to respone as necessary if something does happen to go wrong . . . like an engine failure. Besides, making excellent dead-stick full-flap landings would look cool.

Comment by Conrad Watters on June 6, 2011 at 6:08pm

What would the indications be for a full flap landing in CH 750. Is it actually functionally useful or just risky?

Comment by Peter Bennett on June 6, 2011 at 8:38am

Thanks, Jim.  I tried a few this morning and quickly learned that there isn't much braking after a full-flap landing; skidding would be more accurate. On the learning side, I have been doing some power-on slow flight with full flaps to get the feel of it. When I qualified to fly "Z" Bird my instructor insisted I do three power-off, full-flap landings. I managed to pull it off, but it was just desperate dumb luck. I've been practicing ever since so I can REALLY do it comfortably.  With no power there is VERY little float and when it quits it QUITS.

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